Page 902 - Mafia, Part 1 (Night Phase)

2nd May 2017, 6:00 AM
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Mafia, Part 1 (Night Phase)
Average Rating: 5 (2 votes)
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Author Notes:

Newbiespud 2nd May 2017, 6:00 AM edit delete
Newbiespud
Author: DragonTrainer

Newbiespud's Note: The contents of the Night Phase pages are spoilers for those deciding to skip until the end. Try not to spoil who's who in future comments sections.

It's not the most elegant solution to this conundrum of spacing out a two-tiered guest arc in regular updates, but given the sheer number of pages and the time I had available, I went for the simplest option.

39 Comments:

Digo Dragon 2nd May 2017, 6:11 AM edit delete reply
Digo Dragon
Hmm, it is a... an interesting game. I've never played, so hopefully how you do your jobs is explained in later pages. :3
Godzfirefly 2nd May 2017, 8:20 AM edit delete reply
In traditional Mafia, the Mafia select someone to murder during each night phase. That murdered player is eliminated from the game and can't speak/participate in the game further. The Detectives/Cops/Sheriff secretly selects a player to try identifying if that player is a Mafioso. They get a yes or no from the referee (usually via a thumbs-up or thumbs-down.) The Nurse selects a player to protect from the Mafia. If the nurse selected a player who was also selected by the Mafia, that person doesn't actually die.

(All selections are made in secret, of course. So, anyone can say they performed any role and got any result. Up to and including saving someone. So, if the Nurse saves someone, only the nurse and mafia actually know who was saved...not even the person saved knows for sure they were the target. And, faking being either Nurse or Sheriff is a common ploy for Mafia.)
Digo Dragon 2nd May 2017, 1:33 PM edit delete reply
Digo Dragon
Sounds really random for the most part. I mean if the nurse was killed off in the first round, that's pretty much it, no?
Ishidan 2nd May 2017, 4:19 PM edit delete reply
Presumably the nurse can save herself.
And thus would be rather required to do so.
Nixitur 2nd May 2017, 6:21 PM edit delete reply
Nixitur
No, Ishidan, the Nurse does not find out who's going to get killed. There are extra roles that do find that out, but they don't have unlimited healing/protection ability like the Nurse does.
So, yes, if the Nurse dies in the first night, that's a huge blow to the town. But if the Nurse always just protects themself, they not only make themself incredibly suspicious, but also less useful to the town. Protecting themself on the first night is a pretty standard move, though, just to get more information on who to really protect in the future.
Bear in mind, however, that losing the Nurse in the first night is by no means an unwinnable situation. The game is pretty balanced even without that role. Losing the only Detective in the first night, though, makes the Mafia extremely likely to win. However, that's why this game has two Detectives.
Digo Dragon 3rd May 2017, 4:53 AM edit delete reply
Digo Dragon
How would the nurse protecting herself make her suspicious? It doesn't sound like anyone knows who is who ever except for the Cop/Investigator?
Nixitur 3rd May 2017, 6:37 AM edit delete reply
Nixitur
Ah, hmm, good point, probably not with this particular choice of roles. But if the Nurse only always protected themself and the Mafiosi tried to kill them several times, that would make that role incredibly obvious to the Mafiosi which is something you extremely want to avoid. Because as the Nurse, you have little reason to always protect the same person unless it's you.
Freemage 2nd May 2017, 8:25 AM edit delete reply
It's a dual-elimination game.

The Mafia are trying to kill everyone who isn't Mafia. They get one 'kill' per night phase. Whoever they pick is out (but see the Nurse).

The Cops are trying to catch the Mafia guys--they get one 'pick' during the night phase to decide who to interrogate. If they get a Mafia guy, that player is out. (I'm not sure what happens if they pick a non-Mafia player. I believe in the other version of this game I know of, Werewolf, the townspeople actually lynch the suspect.)

The Nurse is trying to save people from being killed. If the nurse guesses who the Mafia are targeting, they make it through the night.

Civilians are just there to confound everyone.
Freemage 2nd May 2017, 8:27 AM edit delete reply
Oops. In this game, the Mafia are able to eliminate two characters per night.
Godzfirefly 2nd May 2017, 8:30 AM edit delete reply
I've never played a version of Mafia (or Werewolf...or whatever) where the Sheriff's choice eliminates the Mafia, even if they find the mafia. I've always seen it played that the Sheriff then has to convince others that they found the Mafioso and get everyone to vote that player out during the day phase.
Nixitur 2nd May 2017, 8:36 AM edit delete reply
Nixitur
There's a whole slew of different roles and rules, but this is one of the simplest setups. The Nurse is the only optional role that's taken in this game. Mafia are required because otherwise there wouldn't be a game and Detectives are required because without them, it would be completely unbalanced. People actually ran the numbers and just having one or more detectives instantly balanced the game.

A variant rule that we always play with is that the Detectives not only find out whether the person they picked is a Mafioso, but also which role they have. This is more important if you have way more roles. In our games, the vast majority of players usually has a role.

Edit: Godzfirefly, that's exactly what "eliminate" means in this context. It's in the sense of "eliminating a possibility" rather than "kill".
And no, Freemage, it's obviously just one character they check in this game. I have no idea where you got two players from. Spike is the GM.

Edit2: Wait, hang on, Freemage, in your Mafia games, the Detectives are the ones killing the Mafiosi in the night phase? I have never heard that rule before. That seems like it would be extremely overpowered in favor of the Detectives. Not to mention, what's the day phase for, then? At the end of the day phase, the entire town votes for one person to execute. That's how the game works, it's always been that way.
Greenhornet 2nd May 2017, 10:33 AM edit delete reply
"EDIT 2"
Call the detectives/cops "vigilantes" and their killing the mobsters makes sense. Historically, a vigilante group will either defend against criminal activity as it happens, or will actively hunt the gangs. It depends on their goals, resources and organization.
Nixitur 2nd May 2017, 6:15 PM edit delete reply
Nixitur
You will note that I did not complain about it not making sense from a flavor perspective. The flavor is extremely loose in Mafia/Werewolf, anyway. No, all my complaints were about the design of the game.
Godzfirefly 3rd May 2017, 12:40 AM edit delete reply
@Nixitur: When Freemage said two players, he was referring to the Mafia eliminating two players. Which, they absolutely did try...Luna and Applejack.
Nixitur 3rd May 2017, 6:26 AM edit delete reply
Nixitur
Oh man, I didn't even see that the Mafia point out two victims. I didn't even fully read that part because I never even considered that there could be a variation in that rule.
That's... honestly real freaking weird. Even when we play with like 24 players and 8 Werewolves (Mafiosi), they can only ever kill one other character. I suppose it makes sense to have multiple kills when you have multiple Detectives, though. I feel like having multiple kills per night, but only one "investigation" by the Detectives stacks the odds in the Mafia's favor, though.
Freemage 3rd May 2017, 9:12 AM edit delete reply
It's kind of like Rummy--assume that any rule can, and has in fact been, modified by one group or another at some time. It happens both deliberately ("I think the game would be more interesting if...") and accidentally ("Wait, were there supposed to be 7 or 10 cards...?").
Kaze Koichi 2nd May 2017, 11:07 PM edit delete reply
I personally prefer Werewolves. It's faster (only last one night) and have additional fun factor with you not sure if you going to finish with the same role you started (and in the case with some roles, you know that you are going to have a different role).
AceOfSpace 3rd May 2017, 6:22 AM edit delete reply
You're specifically talking about one night werewolf, which is no thee same as werewolf or ultimate werewolf, which last until one side wins by regular standards. (The difference between werewolf and ultimate werewolf being that ultimate werewolf has way more (optional) additional roles including some optional extra sides for particularly large groups)
Kaze Koichi 3rd May 2017, 1:31 PM edit delete reply
It's like comparing Mafia to Town of Salem
Tempestfury 2nd May 2017, 6:28 AM edit delete reply
Seems like a lot of people were right about RD being the Nurse.
DoubleXXCross 2nd May 2017, 7:15 AM edit delete reply
Now, blame my lack of experience with Mafia, but that's not how nurses work.
TJ 2nd May 2017, 7:51 AM edit delete reply
For the sake of people who care about spoilers, I feel like Night Phase comics should be a click-through.
Guest 2nd May 2017, 8:09 AM edit delete reply
There's more mystery to the game when you're ALSO trying to figure out who's playing.

But I'm down to 14 candidates, so I should have it figured out soon.
Jennifer 2nd May 2017, 11:02 AM edit delete reply
Here's the problem: If you don't have spoilers (and I'm not sure what spoilers there are given that we are reading a comic strip?) how do I ask the questions that are on my mind when they get to the discussion phase? It would be useful to use charnames...

For example: If Character A is chosen to die and is saved by the nurse, the nurse can't explain why CharA is not a Mafioso without giving herself away as the nurse. The Mafioso has no idea whether CharA is a nurse protecting herself or was protected by a different nurse. CharA has no idea she was even in danger. What has anyone learned that helps them in future turns at all?
Chakat Firepaw 4th May 2017, 12:22 AM edit delete reply
Basically: In the comment section of Day Phases, only include information revealed during the day, you don't mention any information from a Night Phase. So, you can't mention who the Nurse is or who she protected.
Guest 2nd May 2017, 11:25 AM edit delete reply
If the nurse protects some one and no one dies in the night phase the nurse can assume her target is not mafia. Problem with having a doctor and a cop is follow the cop syndrome happens which makes it unbalanced against the mafia.
Freemage 3rd May 2017, 9:10 AM edit delete reply
Of course, since in this version, the Mafia are killing two people every night, that gets balanced out a bit.
Jennifer 3rd May 2017, 10:57 AM edit delete reply
She can assume it, but she can't say so without revealing that she's the nurse.
Chakat Firepaw 4th May 2017, 12:24 AM edit delete reply
Actually, all she needs to know is that she saved someone. So RD now knows, (or will come dawn), that AJ is probably either a Detective or a Civilian.
Winged Cat 2nd May 2017, 12:32 PM edit delete reply
Winged Cat
Huh. Looks like nobody (from last strip's guesses) guessed the first detective.
Tentreto 2nd May 2017, 4:15 PM edit delete reply
Now the mind games begin, as everyone tries to guess who would forget the role they had. Which for me is a heavy part of the meta of knowing who is who.

So I guess that detail isn't really a spoiler?
Winged Cat 2nd May 2017, 11:17 PM edit delete reply
Winged Cat
Given what was said in the previous strip, I suspect it will be obvious enough that he's dying next night. (And the townies might thank the mafia for helping the game move along.)
Tsvorla 2nd May 2017, 10:36 PM edit delete reply
Not to be that gal, but what is up with that skewed moon in the first panel? It's not just me, right?
Ishidan 2nd May 2017, 11:00 PM edit delete reply
I don't know, but I do enjoy the irony in Luna being eliminated in the first night.
By a coalition that includes Rarity.
Winged Cat 2nd May 2017, 11:18 PM edit delete reply
Winged Cat
It's not just you. That's either an animation error or an aspect-ratio-off panel.
FanOfMostEverything 4th May 2017, 6:02 AM edit delete reply
If I had to guess, I'd say it's from either Discord or Twilight moving the moon, thus causing acceleration stretching as it careens under or over the horizon.
Jennifer 3rd May 2017, 5:17 PM edit delete reply
What happens if a cop is killed? Can they still hunt a mafioso on the same turn?
Chakat Firepaw 4th May 2017, 12:32 AM edit delete reply
Yep, consider that everything is actually happening at the same time and the various sub-phases are just to make the game playable.

With some of the optional roles, the order does matter as some people get to peek at what others are doing. The order matters because some of them just get to know what certain other players actually did and some also get to use that information to decide what to do that night.
BadHorse 13th Jun 2017, 8:13 AM edit delete reply
So, I guessed Fluttershy, Shining Armor, and Rainbow Dash correctly.